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        riddles >> easy >> Falling Wine
        
(Message started by: flamingdragon on Nov 29^th, 2006, 9:41pm)

Title: Falling Wine
Post by flamingdragon on Nov 29^th, 2006, 9:41pm

Whilst in a balloon floating stationary off the coast of france, I dropped two wine bottles over the side. If one was empty and the other full, which hit the ground first?

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by THUDandBLUNDER on Nov 30^th, 2006, 12:17am

[hide]The empty one - it was obviously carried ashore by the Mistral.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mistral_(wind)[/hide]

:P

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by jollytall on Nov 30^th, 2006, 1:11am

It depends on four things:
Is the empty bottle corked? Usually I don't re-cork my empty wine bottles.
Is the full bottle really full, or only full as a usual wine bottle is (with air above it making the average density less)?
Is the sea-bed considered ground?
How far are we off-shore?

Assuming the seabed ground too:
If the empty bottle is not corked it will definitely sink. The full bottle might also sink, but because of the cork and some air, it might even float. If both sink, then I would go for the empty bottle sinking faster.
If the full bottle floats, then the question is whether the sea is deap or the shore is close. Most of the time the empty bottle will sink to bottom faster than the floating full bottle reaching shore. The only exception can be when we are really close to shore (like half a meter) and the sea is deep. Then the first wave throws the bottly on-shore (smashing it to a rock most likely) while the other is sinking.
If the empty bottle corked and the full bottle sinks, it is just the other way around, although the sinking speed of a full bottle might be long, so we do not need to be that close to shore.
If both float (empty corked, full has enough air and the cork), then I would go for the empty bottle, as it can better "surf" on the waves, but I could use an opposite argument, saying that the full bottle floats deeper, so the moving of the water impacts it more, thus reaching land faster. I think this point worse further discussion.

If the seabed is not considered ground, then the one sinks has no chance (and so maybe none of the two). If both float then we are back to the previous point.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by flamingdragon on Nov 30^th, 2006, 7:45am

Hmm, how bout I just give it to u instead of reading that.

I read it, and that is sort of an overkill answer.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by THUDandBLUNDER on Nov 30^th, 2006, 7:55am

on 11/30/06 at 07:45:00, flamingdragon wrote:

Hmm, how bout I just give it to u instead of reading that.

I read it, and that is sort of an overkill answer.

That'll teach you to ask trick questions! :D

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by flamingdragon on Nov 30^th, 2006, 8:01am

Hmm, well maybe the UBERPUZZLERS shouldn't be answering questions in the easy section? ::)

BTW I love the word uber, excellent job to whoever for making it uberpuzzler.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by Whiskey Tango Foxtrot on Nov 30^th, 2006, 8:05am

I don't mean to slight him in any way, but jollytall is not an Uberpuzzler. I think he is "allowed" to post here.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by flamingdragon on Nov 30^th, 2006, 8:10am

Oh, probly shoulda noticed that. :-/

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by jollytall on Nov 30^th, 2006, 9:10am

Oh dragon, don't you want to suggest that the intended solution was that none of them will reach, since they will both fall in the water instead of ground. I though we deserve more than this.
[hide]Don't take it seriously, I am only joking. My point in the first reply was to show that even a tricky riddle (btw. it was around already in the forum, in the form of a plane leaving Africa to the west with speed x, etc.) can be taken seriously and can raise a real question.[/hide]

But back to the original problem:
There is a pool of water with a constant wind above it that even generates waves on the surface of the water. We put in the pool two corked bottles, one of them empty inside, the other half full. Which one reaches the other side first.
[hide]For uberpuzzlers, what I am not (yet): Yes, we put it on the logically selected side of the pool, the water is in liquid form, etc., etc.[/hide]

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by Grimbal on Dec 4^th, 2006, 1:17am

on 11/30/06 at 01:11:37, jollytall wrote:

If the empty bottle is not corked it will definitely sink.

I'd say it will eventually sink. But on a calm sea it might well end up half full with the opening pointing either up or down, in both cases it would stop filling up.

Btw, what about islands?

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by jollytall on Dec 4^th, 2006, 3:00am

Would you say "off the coast of France" rather than "above the island of Journsey"?

You are right about the uncorked bottle and the calm sea.

I'm still looking for the pool solution. Any thoughts?

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by ChunkTug on Dec 4^th, 2006, 3:06am

on 12/04/06 at 03:00:59, jollytall wrote:

I'm still looking for the pool solution. Any thoughts?

My first guess would be the empty bottle just because it weighs less.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by Grimbal on Dec 4^th, 2006, 3:33am

For the islands, there could be small uncharded islands off the French coast .

For the pool, I'd say the empty bottle offers more surface to the wind. It will go faster.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by jollytall on Dec 4^th, 2006, 8:41am

That was my first though too. But then I got unsure, because although the water moves probably slower, the move of the water is more efficient. So the one deeper in the water can move faster.

???

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by Grimbal on Dec 5^th, 2006, 5:05am

I assumed the water is not moving while the air is. Of course, if there are strong currents in the water, it is a different story.

Generally speaking, the speed of the bottle will be some average between the speed of the water and the speed of the air. The more the bottle is in the air, the more its speed will be close to the speed of the air.

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by jenny on Dec 8^th, 2006, 11:27am

k. the real questions here are:
a. why did you drop the wine in the first place
and b. why didn't you drink the one that had wine in it.

the reason i say this is because, we're all saying the same thing over, and over, and that we don't have enough info to really decide.

I don't bleive the seabed will count as grounded, and there is a cork in the bottles, so i beleive the empty one will land first

Title: Re: Falling Wine
Post by rmsgrey on Dec 9^th, 2006, 12:32pm

on 12/08/06 at 11:27:31, jenny wrote:

The answer to a) is "To annoy you" and the answer to b) is "To get rid of the bottle that killed up to 10 prisoners"